GMC Acadia Forum banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
The biggest question about the Acadia's future has been "When will the V8 arrive?"

Many people have been hoping for 2009, but my gut has been saying 2010. February's Motor Trend says the same--for the Enclave. When discussing VLE Anna Kretz in their "Power List" on page 88, they list her upcoming challenges as the 2009 Chevrolet Traverse and "2010 Buick Enclave Super with the high-feature V8."

Oddly, no mention of other Lambdas getting the V8. Just an oversight, or no Acadia Denali and Traverse Sport? (I'm thinking no V8 for the Saturn, given the brand's image.)

UPDATE: GM announced on 1-3-2008 that they've killed the planned Ultra V8. Motor Trend now claims that the reason is GM decided that the DI V6 would power the Lambdas well enough. Personally, I suspect a combination of CAFE and the difficulty of engineering a transaxle to handle 350+ pounds-feet of torque.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
812 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

mkaresh said:
The biggest question about the Acadia's future has been "When will the V8 arrive?"

Many people have been hoping for 2009, but my gut has been saying 2010. February's Motor Trend says the same--for the Enclave. When discussing VLE Anna Kretz in their "Power List" on page 88, they list her upcoming challenges as the 2009 Chevrolet Traverse and "2010 Buick Enclave Super with the high-feature V8."

Oddly, no mention of other Lambdas getting the V8. Just an oversight, or no Acadia Denali and Traverse Sport? (I'm thinking no V8 for the Saturn, given the brand's image.)
Buick is GM focus brand right now after Saturn, you'll know it based on commercial and Enclave marketing on the automotive Press alone. Acadia is nowhere in sight....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
956 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

The Acadia does not need more power, it just needs to weigh less. With the govt. mandated CAFE standards of 35 mpg in the future the writing is on the wall for vehicles of this size and weight.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
812 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

big bear craig said:
The Acadia does not need more power, it just needs to weigh less. With the govt. mandated CAFE standards of 35 mpg in the future the writing is on the wall for vehicles of this size and weight.
I agree with you BBC but i think GM cant afford for now an all aluminum chassis and carbon fiber underpinnings for the Acadia.... ;D

it would be interesting what the new vehicle design would be for a vehicle that goes 35mpg, i would think cars like the Scion Xb, Pontiac Vibe, Toyota Matrix,Honda CRV,etc. will be categorized as full-sized SUV. :beer:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

It's not what GM can afford, it's what car buyers are willing to pay for.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
100 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

I don't believe the 35 m.p.g is what we all think. I am pretty sure that is the average that must be met by the sum of all of the vendors vehicles. Why do you think chevy keeps some of those smaller cars around that look like a metro or a geo. They throw the numbers off fairly well. In addition, they somehow were able to get trucks like the silverado excluded from that total sum.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
956 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

Jason you are right, but the higher the CAFE standard the more fuel efficent vehicles a manufacture must sell to meet the standards.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
38 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

The Acadia cannot weigh substantially less without reducing its size. Even heavily de-contenting the vehicle will not reduce weight sufficiently to come close to the new CAFE requirements (less severe than EPA reqs.). The Lambdas are perfectly sized for me, I wouldn't buy the Acadia if it was smaller.

I've been involved in the development of net-shape advanced composite part mfg processes that produce epoxy-carbon fiber parts cheaper than usual methods. But even with automobile industry part volumes, the cost would be prohibitive compared to steel and we wouldn't be willing to pay the cost differential. Accident repairs would also be much more expensive. Aluminum costs are significantly higher than steel as well.

As long as we're using an ICE propulsion system with all the performance and creature/safety/environmental stewardship content of the present vehicle, we can expect no more than approx. 15% improvement in fuel mileage. To get more, we have have give up something and/or pay more.

I hope GM is able to adapt a two-mode hybrid, and ultimately a Volt-derived electric propulsion system with an ICE mileage extender, to the Lambda platform for a price that we can afford. The costs to GM, including reprocessing the used batteries will be huge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
956 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

If GM and the other manufactures cannot meet the new CAFE standards we won't have a choice on vehicle size. Cars will have to get smaller and lighter to achieve the better mileage that will be mandated.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
38 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

big bear craig said:
If GM and the other manufactures cannot meet the new CAFE standards we won't have a choice on vehicle size. Cars will have to get smaller and lighter to achieve the better mileage that will be mandated.
Craig

My personal choice is to use engineering and science to solve the issue so that our vehicles are sized to US physiological/geographical demographics while getting mileage consistent with our financial means. Equally important is the strategic need to end our reliance on energy obtained from diminishing and hostile sources. This has been the typical American response to a problem, at least the ones that command my respect. We are not land-locked like the Europeans and Japanese. To date, our population density is not that high in most areas. Using our substantial technological prowess (both home-grown and fed by immigration), we can solve the energy issue and still drive vehicles sized to our needs. We don't need to cut and run like the Europeans have elected to do.

Jim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

tekwarrior said:
The Acadia cannot weigh substantially less without reducing its size. Even heavily de-contenting the vehicle will not reduce weight sufficiently to come close to the new CAFE requirements (less severe than EPA reqs.). The Lambdas are perfectly sized for me, I wouldn't buy the Acadia if it was smaller.

I've been involved in the development of net-shape advanced composite part mfg processes that produce epoxy-carbon fiber parts cheaper than usual methods. But even with automobile industry part volumes, the cost would be prohibitive compared to steel and we wouldn't be willing to pay the cost differential. Accident repairs would also be much more expensive. Aluminum costs are significantly higher than steel as well.

As long as we're using an ICE propulsion system with all the performance and creature/safety/environmental stewardship content of the present vehicle, we can expect no more than approx. 15% improvement in fuel mileage. To get more, we have have give up something and/or pay more.

I hope GM is able to adapt a two-mode hybrid, and ultimately a Volt-derived electric propulsion system with an ICE mileage extender, to the Lambda platform for a price that we can afford. The costs to GM, including reprocessing the used batteries will be huge.
Very well said, with the possible exception of the last bit. The last time I checked, the cost of reprocessing NiMH batteries can be entirely paid for by the value of the nickel they contain. This will be even more the case if demand for nickel causes its cost to increase, while higher volumes bring down the cost of reprocessing.

GM is initially charging close to $10,000 for the two-mode hybrid system in the Tahoe, once rebates are included in the calculation. So they have a way to go before this system is affordable.

Might be time for Detroit to finally offer the 100 MPG carburetor...or maybe those trick magnets...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
468 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

mkaresh said:
Very well said, with the possible exception of the last bit. The last time I checked, the cost of reprocessing NiMH batteries can be entirely paid for by the value of the nickel they contain. This will be even more the case if demand for nickel causes its cost to increase, while higher volumes bring down the cost of reprocessing.
The cost of raw nickel would have to go up to make that statement true, would it not? How else can you recycle one part of an assembly and end up recouping the original cost of the product? That would make rest of the battery in effect free during manufacturing, and that surely is not the case.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

When I last checked, the net cost of recyling a battery, that is the cost of recycling it minus the revenue from selling the retrieved nickel, was near zero. For the battery pack in the Prius, I recall both numbers being around $200--but could be off on this.

I also think nickel was around $5/pound when I did that research. It's now around $12 after spiking to $25 last spring:

http://www.kitcometals.com/charts/nickel_historical_large.html

When it hit $25, the business case for hybrids must have gotten nasty. A Prius uses about 40 pounds of the stuff, so when nickel went from $5 to $25 that would have added about $800 to Toyota's costs--if Toyota's price wasn't fixed by long-term contracts (which no doubt it is). But other manufacturers might not have locked in the price when it was lower.

Anyway, if the value of the nickel covered the cost of recycling before, it does so by a considerable percentage now.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,762 Posts
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

Another forum mentioned that Bob Lutz was quoted as saying the upcoming Chevy Traverse will be the first Hybrid Lambda. I'm guessing this will also be in 2010 (it's second model year). I wouldn't be surprised to see V8s in the Enclave (Super) and Acadia (Denali), and hybrids in the Outlook (Green Line) and Traverse in either 2010 or 2011.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Re: Motor Trend says Enclave Super with HF V8 in 2010

The Chevrolet will probably end up with all powertrains.

Otherwise you have both V8 Lambdas in the same dealership.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top